The Mahogany Tower August 2019 Spotlight: Carlos Osuna
Carlos and I were both part of the 2012 Career Prep Program for Management Leadership 4 Tomorrow. Ironically though, I never actually met Carlos until a summer program in 2013 hosted by the Harvard Business School (HBS). We chopped it up about our career interests, struggled through HBS cases, and went our separate ways at the close of the program.
In hindsight, we did business school all wrong. You don’t go to HBS to study. You go to HBS to travel and network. Things no one tells you…….. anyway.
We reconnected again in 2018 when he got admitted to Columbia. I told him about Year 1 in a doctoral program and how to get off to a great start (which is ironic, because my 1st year was an ABSOLUTE TRAIN WRECK). When I asked him to do a Spotlight for The Mahogany Tower, he was ecstatic. Carlos has a super dope, inspirational story. What he’s done and where he’s come from are nothing short of phenomenal. Read below!
ACADEMIC BIO
- Doctor of Education (Ed.D.), Adult Learning and Leadership, Columbia University, Teachers College
- Master of Education (M.Ed.), Learning Design and Technology, USC Rossier School of Education
- Bachelor of Arts (B.A.), American Studies — concentration in Business and Ethics, University of California, Berkeley
About Carlos
Mexican American (family is from Culiacán, Sinaloa)
Ed.D Student (Adult Learning & Leadership)
Living in NYC (The city that never sleeps)
Born in Boyle Heights (near East Los Angeles)
Grew up in LA (323)
UC Berkeley (Take me back!)
USC/Grad school (moved back home)
Age 27 (#LivingMyBestLife)
Shutterbug (photographer at heart)
Q: In my experience, many of the students in advanced degree programs come from households of high socioeconomic status (SES). In your case though, you’re from a low-income community. What were some of the unique challenges that came with that?
Many people don’t know this about me, but I was born three months premature. Growing up, I was constantly in and out of the hospital. Furthermore, as a Latino from low-income single-parent household, my experiences growing up absolutely shape how I see the world. I grew up in communities where dropping out was common. I quickly became aware of the adversity around me. I think my background and experiences initiated my interest and devotion to making sure that learning environments provide every single person with an equal opportunity to succeed.
I attended UC Berkeley as a Gates Millennium Scholar. During my time at UC Berkeley, I focused on two things: (1) being a hard worker, and (2) taking every challenge as an opportunity. My high school didn’t prepare me for the rigorous workload of UC Berkeley, so I had to adapt quickly if I planned to stay. Also, let’s be honest; elite institutions weren’t created for people like us. Getting admitted to a university and graduating from a university are equally important but very different outcomes with unique challenges. Post-grad, too, presents another set of challenges for low SES students. I don’t think that institutions do a great job of supporting students from low SES backgrounds. Even with scholarship money, having those financial resources doesn’t necessarily assist one in navigating the social system that is higher education. I think preparing for post-grad is probably the most critical stage for first-generation college students. The way you leave college is probably more important than the way you started.
I say this because I vividly remember a time in college, where my classmate and I were expressing how hard an assignment was, and when I asked her how she managed to finish her essay, she said, “oh, my mom edited my paper.” As soon as I heard this, I realized I was in an uphill battle… but that’s the world we live in.
Having gone through these three sets of challenges: (1) getting into college, (2) surviving/thriving college, and (3) preparing for post-grad…I face a new challenge: thinking through ways in which I can be an advocate for underrepresented minorities in spaces that would benefit tremendously from diversity.
Q: You’re the first person in your family to attend college, and you’re working on your 3rd degree from one of the most esteemed institutions for higher education in the world. Can you share one or two big things that helped you get where you are?
Build a personal board of directors. Think of yourself as the CEO of an organization (Your Life Inc.). Similar to an organization, you have your mission, goals, source of income, and other things. Like an organization, it is important to have a board of directors, which is a group of invested individuals who can provide input and guidance based on their experience and expertise. It’s YOUR life, so be sure to be selective in choosing your board of directors. Mentors. Bosses. Coaches. Advisors. Faculty. Friends. Family members (mom!), etc. It doesn’t have to be formal; you just need a system to go about soliciting input and advice on life decisions, developments, changes, etc.
Make sure that you feel safe to share your thoughts and learning with this group of people. Life is sure to take you places where you have to make difficult decisions, so you’ll need them. In my experience, conversations with my board have led to some of my most defining moments in life. Finally, it’s worth mentioning… don’t be afraid to change your board of directors. Not everyone is meant to be there forever :-).
Q: I usually find difficulty explaining my career to people, given most people don’t have a PhD and don’t plan on pursuing one. In your case, did you find difficulty articulating that to friends and family, particularly given growing up in lower-income communities? Did Latin culture play a role at all in that, too?
Yes. And Yes. Ever since I was a little kid, I have always dreamed of getting ‘Dr.’ as part of my name. Not sure why since it is a very odd thing for a kid to think about. If I have to guess, it’s probably because I spent most of my childhood at the hospital. It wasn’t until college I became aware that the world actually has many different kinds of “doctors”, ranging from surgeons to psychologists and philosophers to educators. As soon as I found out that there’s another way to add ‘Dr.’ in front of my name, I was fired up to know that I, too, could be a doctor and help people. Explaining this to my family and friends from back home was …and still is… difficult… as we tend to associate doctors with medicine more than anything else.
And because it is not a doctor of medicine, many people have this misconception that it is much easier—but it’s not. Furthermore, it’s rare to see people who I grew up with pursuing a graduate degree, let alone a doctoral degree. Even among my brightest friends, I frequently find myself explaining and justifying not only why I plan on earning a doctorate but why I think I am capable or worthy of the journey. Needless to say those conversations can spark insecurities about what I’m doing (imposter syndrome at its finest).
However, I’ve learned that pursuing a doctoral degree is a very personal choice, and I don’t really need to explain or justify it to anyone. But sure, there are many, many people in my inner circle who have difficulty understanding what a PhD is about, in which case I then explain, rather than justify.
Q: In addition to growing up in a household with a more modest income, it was also just you and your mom for awhile, too. Do you find that shaped your experience in getting where you are as well?
I love this question. I appreciate you asking me this as you know I grew up with strong beautiful females in my household which influences my way of thinking, for sure… I think that everyone has a special person who has had a significant influence in their life. For some, it’s a superhero or a teacher, but for me, it’s my mom. My mom always told me, “where there’s a will, there’s a way,” to constantly remind me to never give up on my goals. As I mentioned earlier, I was born prematurely at the end of five months and only weighing a few lbs. I have undergone multiple surgeries, and still expecting to undergo more. In addition to being born premature and consequently having to deal with continuous surgeries, I also grew up in a single parent household. Nevertheless, from my father’s absence, I learned who I really did have in my life—my mom. Through her experiences and life struggles, she was able to give me the advice that led me to persevere and become the person I am today. I am proud of who I’ve become in relation to who I could have been. I had so many opportunities to give up because of my obstacles, but I’m still standing and continue to face many challenges in my life. I do hope to show my community that there are no obstacles big enough to prevent us from reaching our dreams. Obstacles shouldn’t have to stop an individual. If a person runs into a wall, don’t turn around and give up. Instead figure out how to climb it, go through it, or walk around it.
Although my mom never graduated from college (I know she will one day), she always told me that education is the key to success. For that, I’ll forever be grateful.
Q: I know everyone’s experience in arriving at an advanced degree program is unique, but I was particularly interested in your story, because you had plans on doing consulting and working on wall street at one point. Can you weigh in about your time in undergrad, in a nutshell?
As a Latino from a low-income community, I grew up with this “society pressure” that I needed to make money. Following my interests was important, but I felt a very real pressure to make money and be successful, too. I vividly remember growing up with family members extremely excited about my performance in school and the awesome job they thought I’d have when I graduated. Truth be told, this led me to explore careers in business.
Throughout college, I took advantage of many resources along the way. One of those resources was, actually, MLT – Management Leadership for Tomorrow. I think this is how we both met. We both did the career prep fellowship. I think these types of opportunities truly opens the doors for people like us. For undergrad, I did everything a typical “business” student would do—I interned at PwC, Credit Suisse, Wells Fargo, and participated in a few pre-MBA programs including programs at the Harvard Business School and Yale School of Management.
However, my favorite classes in undergrad weren’t business courses. In fact, I hated them, ironically. My passion is in education and learning. My favorite classes at UC Berkeley were on education topics. In hindsight, this is how I got interested in adult learning. I was intrigued by the idea of using business and education to help change the world. Thus, it led me to pursue a doctoral degree in Adult Learning and Leadership at Columbia University because learning takes place in all environments including the workplace.
I will admit, my journey didn’t make sense until recently. Majority of my undergrad experience—I was lost. However, I do believe in one thing: I believe that if you hold true to who you are, and your values, then eventually you will end up at the place you are meant to be. It took some time, but I got here, and I believe I’m exactly where I’m supposed to be. I’m grateful for the experience and journey.
Q: You finally got an offer from a consulting firm, but then you said some crazy stuff happened. What happened, and how did you bounce back after that disappointment?
In 2013, I had got an offer to work at a consulting firm. Unfortunately, my job offer was dissolved due to the government shutdown, which left me with no job after college (scary times!). During this time, I decided to apply to Teach For America (TFA), and surprisingly, I got an offer to teach high school math in Los Angeles. Ultimately, I declined because I was doing it for the wrong reasons (because I needed a job, rather than because of the kids). I had to really unpack my emotions and be patient in figuring out what I wanted to do. Eventually, I was admitted to the first cohort of the Learning Design and Technology graduate program at University of Southern California Rossier School of Education.
Q: An Ed.D is a bit different from other types of advanced degrees. Can you weigh in more about that and how you decided between that and a ‘traditional’ Ph.D.?
Ed.D stands for Doctor of Education and Ph.D stands for Doctor of Philosophy. Ph.D is usually more theoretically focused, whereas an Ed.D is more applied and practitioner focused. The doctoral program you decided to pursue really depends on what you want to do with the degree. If you want to create new knowledge and stay in academia, then perhaps a PhD is your best bet. If you want to utilize the research and apply it outside of academia such as in an organization or system level structure like school district, then an Ed.D is probably better. Given my long-term interests, an EdD was best for me. I’m fortunate that I have the opportunity to study at Columbia University, learning from phenomenal scholars in the field of education.
Q: Talk to me about life in NY. Both LA and NY have a rich tradition for Latino culture. Have you been able to connect with some of that at all? Is it hard being that far from home?
Well, you know how they say that east coast is very different from west coast? Well, that’s true, too, concerning the Latinx culture. Latinx culture in LA is completely different than NYC’s. Growing up in Boyle Heights (near East Los Angeles) where the population is over 95% Latinx, I saw more Mexicans. In general, LA has more Mexicans, Salvadorians and Cubans. Now that I live in NYC, there’s a much bigger presence of Puerto Ricans and Dominicans.
In LA, I grew up speaking Spanish and going to supermarket to buy certain ingredients to make a mexican dish. Now, even though I see my people and speak Spanish to the cashier, it doesn’t feel the same. For example, certain Latin supermarket do not have certain ingredients I would need to make my mexican dish. There are hubs in NYC where I see more Mexicans, but Manhattan is not one of them—I would have to go to Queens or the Bronx to see more of the Latinx culture I grew up with—and even those boroughs have their own Latinx culture.
With this being said, yes—it is hard to live far from home, especially if you value family. Luckily, I have my little sister on the east coast (currently at MIT for undergrad). In addition, I have my Latinx friends in NYC who I have now adopted as part of my family… helping me stay true to my Mexican side. And I am very lucky to be in NYC where a lot of my friends, including Latinx folks, visit so I get another opportunity to connect with my roots/people/culture. I also try my best to visit home as often for grounding purposes, too.
Q: You just finished Year 1. What would you tell yourself if you could go back to 12 months ago?
“To avoid giving a long list, I think I can sum it up to two things: (1) stay true to who you are, and (2) don’t compare your success with others. We all pursue higher education for different reasons. Thus, we have our own definition of what success looks like and how we plan to get there. It’s so easy to compare yourself with another person who is such as bad@$$ and feel like you’re not accomplishing anything. This is very dangerous as it’s false assessment in how you’re doing but I recognize that we have conditioned our mind to compare—I am still learning to unlearn, and allowing myself to be inspired by the success of others. The doctoral journey is very personal, so it’s okay to say “no” to things that everyone else is doing or follow a path that is nontraditional for doctoral students.”
Q: You shared a little bit about your vision for yourself following graduating from Columbia. Can you weigh in more about some of the things you’re interested in getting into?
I am inspired to improve the way learning is designed by advocating the needs of the learners (especially from marginalized communities) through the lens of culture and context while promoting 21st-century skills. My work experience has taught me to embrace the impact of social and cultural differences in order to design learning initiatives, training, and leadership development programs more effectively. I am passionate about diversity, equity, and inclusion and placing “learning” in the center of our work.
As a doctoral student at Columbia, I want to become a better facilitator, practitioner, and promote discussions that will help us to think about ways to support adults’ growth within any organizations. More specifically, I want to engage with any organizations that are not only thinking about ideas and systems but also creating a space to support those learners who come from diverse backgrounds. In other words, how do we think about diversity, equity, and inclusion when supporting adult development and organizational development? If an organization is working on answering this question, I want to work there.
Q: I think it’s easy to see a guy like you, with 3 degrees, from PHENOMENAL institutions and just see the end product. Vulnerability time… biggest failure. Ready? Go!
Failures. Where to begin, I have plenty of those, or as I like to call them, “LIFE LESSONS”. But if there is one thing I wish I could have done sooner, it’s accepting and loving everything about myself.
I had a rough childhood, as did many people I know, especially people of color. In addition, as I grow in my career, I see less and less people who look like me, and it becomes more difficult to visualize what success looks like for someone like myself. It wasn’t until recently I truly accepted who I am. Interestingly enough, I always told myself “if I get this degree, I would be more happy or if I get this internship, I will be more successful…” Although it may be true, however, none of it matters if you don’t believe in yourself. The way to believe in yourself is to love and accept yourself. I wish I knew this earlier, because I would have enjoyed every moment and would have been present for all the beautiful memories. Now, I just work on being present and noting “life lessons”, because failure will always be there. How you deal with your failures though will ultimately define your ability to learn and grow, professionally and personally.
Q: Any advice for underrepresented students that are aspiring doctoral students?
Know your why! PLEASE PLEASE PLEASE take some time to reflect on your “why.” Ask yourself, “why you are pursuing this doctoral degree?” You can do this in the form of writing a letter to yourself, journaling, making a video, or telling someone you can trust so when there comes a time (believe me there will come a time), where you are having doubts about your doctoral journey, then that person or the letter you wrote can remind you about your “why.”
In addition to what I wrote above, check out Wazana Tompinks’s twitter post which I think she does a beautiful job at giving advice to underrepresented students who are in graduate school—not directly related to your question but very similar. Fair warning: it’s a bit long but totally worth every word.
Nnam’